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From: Chris Curtis (no email)
Date: Sat Apr 14 2007 - 10:59:22 EDT
I have been reading this thread, and I decided to comment. Others
may disagree, and I'm OK with that.
Ultimately the best relationships ALL start with mutual respect.
(PERIOD!)
My parents both respected each other, but they were from another
era. When they were growing up and getting married there were
"roles" placed on them by society, and (ultimately) their parents
religion (most of us have NO choice what religion we are, it is
chosen for us by our parents). These "roles" made for "unrealistic
expectations" for both my parents, and was a constant source of
difficulty for both of them. Luckily, they are still alive and
married.
Many are brought up today with those same lame "roles" imposed on
them (again by society and parental imposed religion). These "roles"
are STILL the cause of MUCH difficulty between the sexes
(interestingly enough, gays and lesbians are lucky NOT to have those
"limitations", they STILL suffer bigotry from society). These
"religious and societal" roles damage the natural equity between the
sexes and corrupts the relationships.
Once men give up their "natural (NOT)" position as master, and once
women give up their "natural (NOT)" role as subservient maids, then
they are free to explore their MUTUAL lives together in an
environment of respect and caring. Without this, there can be no
freedom and personal growth for BOTH.
Im my house, my wife drinks the beer, and watches sports. She
rarely does much cooking or laundry, or cleaning for that matter. I
(the MAN, puff puff), do most of the laundry, cleaning, and
cooking. It's not that I'm subservient to her, it's that our MUTUAL
respect (and rejection of "traditional roles") has allowed us to do
what we do best. While she does not do her traditional "roles" she
IS the best mom my kids (and me) could have EVER hoped for. And I
don't do housework because I HAVE TO, I do it because I LIKE TO (and
I'm better at it!). She focuses on the spiritual and emotional
health of our family, and I focus on infra-structural management on
the clan. We both do what we do best for the survival of the clan unit!
The point is, you will not find a partner in the long run, if you
don't approach it as finding a PARTNER. I know there are women out
there who WILL play the subservient role, I pity the man who gets
himself a slave. For he will never have a "partner" to live out his
life with! And slaves are NEVER loyal to their masters, and rightly
so!
Chris Curtis
On Apr 14, 2007, at 7:23 AM, wrote:
> Thank you Rebecca. You said what all of us are thinking. Amen.
> Carol
> Sweet Dreams - P385
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Conor Crowley <>
> Date: Friday, April 13, 2007 6:04 pm
> Subject: Re: [world-cruising] To the Guy writing on "Life changes
> bring
> a new opportunity"
> To:
>
>> I don't suppose you have a sister ('bout 35, live in S.F.)??
>>
>> On 4/13/07, Rebecca Taft <> wrote:
>>>
>>> Well, I hope no-one knows me on this list…and I cant even
>> believe Im
>>> putting
>>> energy in to talking to the guys that have the ignorance to
>> write some of
>>> this stuff…
>>>
>>> I once married a guy who said he wanted to sail around the world
>> with me.
>>> He
>>> said he wouldn't go until I knew more…after all it takes 2 to go
>> around> the
>>> world says he. SO I studied, read, practiced, etc for 10
>> years…then I
>>> said-
>>> OK I think IM ready. Of course the more I learned the less
>> interested he
>>> was
>>> in it all. He of course said that we couldn't go around the
>> world because
>>> we
>>> needed a better boat than what we had- a Catalina 36…So I worked
>> hard to
>>> get
>>> the boat sold, and found and purchased a Valiant 40….he couldn't
>> use the
>>> boat as a poor excuse anymore…Then I saved my money and had
>> enough to go
>>> for
>>> a few years….Then he said he never really wanted to go in the
>> first place.
>>> SO what did I do…I divorced his ass!!! And I went out and found
>> a guy who
>>> wanted to sail around the world with me. My fiancé calls me the
>> beautiful> chic that came with a paid for boat, and knows or can
>> figure out anything
>>> to
>>> do with any system on the boat! We have been working on getting
>> ourselves> and the boat ready for 3 years now…and it goes in the
>> water at the start
>>> of
>>> July. I was so bummed out when I found out that really we are
>> going to
>>> just
>>> be living on it for 3 months before we depart…that we won't be
>> able to
>>> sail
>>> that much quite yet.
>>>
>>> Anyways, point being…yeah there are a LOT OF WRONG PEOPLE out
>> there for
>>> sailing! Many nice people, but not sailors. And a sailor MUST
>> have a
>>> sailor
>>> or its just doomed…We are a rare breed- male or female who enjoy
>> going> out,
>>> getting wet and cold, living in a small space, conserving water
>> at all
>>> times, losing a lot of sleep!!! We are a rare bunch that find
>> the joy in
>>> sailing. I almost wish I wasn't one of them- I could have maybe
>> saved my
>>> marriage if I didn't love this sport and my boat more! Its in
>> our blood…we
>>> cant get it out…sometimes we hate it ourselves, but we know we
>> will always
>>> come back for more. We look nutty to most of the world…there's
>> only 1 in a
>>> 1000 people who really like this stuff!!! It's hard to find a
>> partner who
>>> likes it, no loves it, embraces, it , lives for it like some of
>> us do!
>>> Male
>>> or female!! Almost always one person is dragging the other!!!
>> Obviously> you
>>> have been dragging people aboard with no plan, no forsight, just
>> a bunch
>>> of
>>> wishful thinking…and then putting down woman who may be great
>> golfers,> great
>>> at something else, just aren't sailors…what did you expect? I
>> wasted 40
>>> years of my life hoping a guy would come around and become a
>> sailor with
>>> me,
>>> a hard core, full time, passionate sailor like me…but I wasn't
>> looking in
>>> the right places…til I went on a rally one day :-)
>>>
>>> Where did you meet the woman you talk about- at a bar? At
>> church? Playing
>>> golf? At work? What do you expect – that you are going to change
>> someone's> inner core to like a sport that is inherently
>> uncomfortable some of the
>>> time, just because they thing your cute? Do you think you are
>> just gonna
>>> luck out? Go look in the right places to find a sailing partner
>> and maybe
>>> you will find one. I signed up to cross an ocean in really bad
>> weather,> not
>>> to find a guy but to try to stop myself from liking sailing so
>> much. It
>>> didn't work…I didn't mind taking my watch and throwing up every
>> few hours
>>> during it. It was a great challenge…I wanted more…I also met the
>> man of my
>>> dreams on that trip….someone who couldn't wait to do it again
>> too…someone> who wanted to make his second circumnavigation with
>> company this time. I
>>> went in cautiously…didn't want to fall in love with someone who
>> didn't> really want to go. You know what's really funny…we saved
>> our money
>>> together
>>> buying and selling houses…and secretly we were BOTH saving on
>> the side too
>>> to make sure it would happen no matter what!…and both of us
>> ended up
>>> saving
>>> within a few thousand dollars of each other on the side…so we
>> doubled our
>>> sailing kitty….that's 2 people that really want to go!!! And we are
>>> going!!!
>>> What do couples do that one person really wants to go and the other
>>> doesn't…Anyways- my point is…why don't you look at other people
>> who are
>>> already sailors, who dream of sailing around the world, so you
>> can share
>>> the
>>> same common goal. DO you think wasting your time on a board like
>> this> rambling about how useless people you have sailed with are,
>> will get you
>>> somewhere? If you want to sail by yourself…go, go sail by
>> yourself…I dont
>>> think anyone will stop you….and if you want to sail with someone
>> you love
>>> and who loves you, stop looking in the wrong places, and stop
>> being a jerk
>>> of a guy, and maybe someone will want to drag you along with
>> them!!! Maybe
>>> they will even let you cook once in a while or haul the anchor
>> if you
>>> behave!
>>>
>>> Maybe you are a gruff, captain who likes just to yell and get
>> impatient> like so many of the male sailors out there!!? Maybe you
>> rush to do all the
>>> lifting, raising sail, unhook from mooring when if you had a
>> real sailing
>>> woman on there with you she would make you look like a fool.
>> Maybe you
>>> think you want a woman to be right there alongside of you loving
>>> everything
>>> you love about sailing- but maybe you just want her to do the
>> things you
>>> don't like doing – like cleaning the head and making the meals-
>> if that's
>>> the case, maybe you will never find anyone to sail with!
>>>
>>> With all that said, I hope you will keep on announcing the
>> things you have
>>> announced in your email about woman…make it very verbal, very
>> known….so> that
>>> all the single sailing woman can recognize you as one of the old
>> fools> with
>>> no class, that they wouldn't want to be trapped on the water
>> with…before> we
>>> waste our precious time with another sailing guy who has no
>> clue, and only
>>> knows how to singlehand…no clue at being a captain…or mate for
>> that matter
>>> :-)
>>>
>>> Rebecca
>>>
>>> _____
>>>
>>> From: <world-
>> cruising%40yahoogroups.com>[mailto:> world-
>> <world-cruising%40yahoogroups.com>]
>>> On Behalf Of Michael Lahrkamp
>>> Sent: Friday, April 13, 2007 12:54 PM
>>> To: <world-
>> cruising%40yahoogroups.com>> Subject: RE: [world-cruising] Re:
>> Life changes bring a new opportunity
>>>
>>> Amen brother ... been there... especially the part about needing
>> to be
>>> back by 4pm... which they tell you at 3pm and your 7+nm out!
>>>
>>> The trick is to find out in advance whether the lady will be high
>>> maintenance. Not to difficult to determine if you watch their
>> behaviour> in advance. 'Course you're assuming the risks if
>> sailing IS the first
>>> date.
>>>
>>> Fair winds,
>>>
>>> Mike
>>>
>>> Beneteau 411, Toronto, Canada
>>>
>>> ________________________________
>>>
>>> From: world-cruising@ <mailto:world-cruising%40yahoogroups.com>
>>> yahoogroups.com
>>> [mailto:world-cruising@ <mailto:world-cruising%40yahoogroups.com>
>>> yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of summer2004
>>> Sent: April 13, 2007 12:04 PM
>>> To: world-cruising@ <mailto:world-cruising%40yahoogroups.com>
>>> yahoogroups.com
>>> Subject: Re: [world-cruising] Re: Life changes bring a new
>> opportunity>
>>> I never re-think, nor do I apologize. "In my opinion" .. the
>> women I
>>> have met are pathetic complainers who are pains in the ass.
>>>
>>> They want to go sailing .. I invite them.
>>>
>>> On Saturday morning they show up at 11:45 am. I have been pacing for
>>> hours.
>>>
>>> Once they unload their belongings, the first question is "have
>> you had
>>> lunch"?
>>>
>>> Next, they ask, "why don't we just hang out in the harbor so I
>> can get a
>>> tan".
>>>
>>> I end up doing all the lifting, raising sail, unhook from
>> mooring, etc.
>>>
>>> As soon as the boat starts to heal "holy shit, we are turning over".
>>>
>>> Then, when the boat is a few miles out they tell me "I must be
>> back at
>>> 4pm".
>>>
>>> HELP..
>>>
>>> You can go on all day long about the great women sailors of the
>> world.> Both of them are swell.
>>>
>>> But .. in my opinion .. women are pathetic when it comes to anything
>>> having to do with sailing.
>>>
>>> I'd rather sail alone.
>>>
>>> sweetdreamswi@ <mailto:sweetdreamswi%40wi.rr.com> wi.rr.com
>>> <mailto:sweetdreamswi%40wi.rr.com> wrote:
>>> You obviously haven't seen too many people out there sailing because
>>> there are alot of very capable women sailing single handed and also
>>> cruising full time taking an equal partnership with handling the
>> boat.> You should rethink your statement and correct.
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: grant harris <gharr8 at yahoo dot <mailto:gharr8%
>> <gharr8%25>40yahoo.com>> com
>>> <mailto:gharr8% <gharr8%25>40yahoo.com> >
>>> Date: Thursday, April 12, 2007 4:18 pm
>>> Subject: Re: [world-cruising] Re: Life changes bring a new
>> opportunity> To: world-cruising@ <mailto:world-
>> cruising%40yahoogroups.com>> yahoogroups.com
>>> <mailto:world-cruising%40yahoogroups.com>
>>>
>>>> Don't be offended, Tender Spirit.
>>>>
>>>> Men leave women. Women leave men. I dont think either gender
>>>> owns the rights to being victim or victimizer.
>>>> Each gender bashes the other fairly regularly. It just depends
>>>> what forum a person might happen to be reading at any given time.
>>>>
>>>> polar_palm_tree <polar_palm_tree@
>> <mailto:polar_palm_tree%40yahoo.com>> yahoo.com
>>> <mailto:polar_palm_tree%40yahoo.com> > wrote:
>>>> WOW!
>>>>
>>>>> I may be a tarnished old single guy but: women are useless
>> on a
>>>> boat. They complain constantly. And the older they get the more
>>>> pathetic they are on board.
>>>>>
>>>> I am sorry you feel that about all women. I am a woman, I take
>> offense> > to that statement.....maybe it's just the women you
>> have associated
>>>> with. I know many women on boats both sailing and commercial
>> fishing> > skippers that certainly do not fit in that
>> catagory!!!!! Please don't
>>>> sterotype us!
>>>>
>>>> S/V Tender Spirit
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>>
>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>>
>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
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>
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